The Virtual Coffeehouse

I also had not thought of this book as similar to Alice at all, I had not really thought of it as a children's book at all, but I suppose that term has come to mean something different than it did then. One commonality I noticed between the two that I don't think has been said yet is that the whole story starts in both novels by our protagonist following someone into a strange land and thus beginning their adventure; Alice with the white rabbit and Kim with the lama. And they are both on a quest to find something, at least Alice is in the second book with her journey to Eighth Square and Kim with the Red Bull.
That's about all I have that wouldn't just be repeating what others have already said, but I really enjoyed reading everyone's posts about this topic.

Like Amanda Haney said, I didn’t really see this as a children’s book the way that I did with “Alice”. I guess one of the main similarities is that the two main characters are in a “strange” land on an adventure. Plus they both have to face certain difficulties. Alice does not fully understand all of the rules of Wonderland, while Kim is white and has a different background. Sorry if this sounded repetitive, but I feel like everything has already been said! But I guess that’s what happens when I post so late…

Both Alice and Kim seem to be called to help solve the problems of the adults they come in contact with. Kim has to help the Lama during the journey, with tasks like buying train tickets and getting around physically. Alice seems to have responsibilities toward the characters she meets as well, providing prizes for the caucus race and taking care of the Dutchess' baby. In both regards, Kim and Alice can't simply float through their adventure without making some contribution to those around them.

Basically i agree with alot of the the other posts so instead of repeating i'll explain why i didnt link the two.

When i hear Alice in Wonderland, or through the looking glass, the first thought is all about nonsense, which im sure is common for many people. When reading Kim the thought of nonsense never crosses my mind, of course i think really youre using more foreign words that i have to look up!?! but never nonsense. No matter how frusterating Kim was or how much i just wanted to put it down and walk away, it was never in my mind linked with Carroll's works. The fact that i was annoyed with it also different bc i enjoyed the Carroll works alot.

but thats just my take on it

DanWang wrote:I agree with the previous posts that that India does represent a sort of Wonderland, but of course this wonderland is real. Kipling's description and idealization (which was often unintentionally racist) of India seemed like a white guy trying to describe a location (India) to other whites (Kipling's reader) that was just as exotic as Wonderland.

Of course then there is the fact both are a commentary of growing up, as both Kim and Alice find themselves confronted with the question of "Who am I?", except Alice of course faces the pressure of acting like a woman, while Kim has the responsibility of acting like "the white man" carrying the White Man's burden.

I found today's question to be interesting. I hadn't given much thought to the similarities between the two books. However, once I took some time to reflect on the two texts it's a bit easier to make a comparason. I think the locations are ironically the most comparable. As the name of this thread implies both India and Wonderland have some similar features. Both are considered exotic and outside the realm of normalcy. Although India is real and Wonderland is not, I think its important to remember that the majority of readers have never and probably never did go to India making that too a rather fantastic, magical place as well. India also has a new code of rules that the reader must adapt to, just like in Wonderland. The language, imagery and footnoes make the reader feel like they're in a different world, Wonderland does the same but through absurd tactics. The adults in both worlds are rather ridiculous people and the reader grows to trust the narrations of two children. I like to think of that moment with the Cheshare Cat when he asks of Alice 'Yes, but who are you?' because I think much of Kim's experiences are an attempt to answer that question for himself. His purpose is to find that red bull and in finding it he will find himself. I think this is also an important similarity to because it relates to our conversations about identity.

“Kim as a boy’s version of the Alice books”

As most everyone has stated, Kipling’s novel depicts India as a sort of ‘wonderland’ – as we’ve said in class, this other world is conveyed as a playground, the India of his imagination flatters a white audience, and an outsider could pretend to be somebody else, then come back home to England when they’re tired. India is portrayed as ‘attractive, alluring, and exotic’… isn’t this how Alice’s Wonderland is viewed? She is allured by it, it is certainly exotic, and in a way, it is an attractive concept to Victorians and people today. I could see the connection between Kipling’s image of India and Carroll’s image of Wonderland, but I agree with many classmates as they have stated that Kim and Alice had vastly different experiences, though the common thread is their having had adventures…

I never thought of comparing the two characters of Alice and Kim, but after reading many of these posts, a lot of similarities are showing up. In the article I presented, the writer said that Kipling always had a romantic view of India, seeing it as a land of beauty and that he had a great love for the people. The problem was that when writing he sometimes came off as oblivious to what the "real" India is like and the India that he writes about. With this, Kim is given a more romantic India that the one that truly existed. Through spirituality and wandering his homeland, he discovers who he really is and how that has affected his life. The same is with Alice, only she is thrown into a world that has never been experienced by another human. She seeks self-discovery in a new land, being sort of like a pioneer. Kim on the other hand is in an imperial world and must find out who he is in a world where he is pressured to choose one culture or the other.